"Opening/Closing Credits" in Comics

BrandonSeifert

This is an idea I've been throwing around.

We do WITCH DOCTOR through Image — which means we have control over what goes in the issue. Letters column, how many pages of ads, which ads, etc — that's all up to us. Usually, we do the common thing of having the inside front cover be a credits page.

My thought it — why not do it the way movies and TV does, and have both an "opening credits" page with the most important people, and a more detailed "closing credits" page at the end listing everybody at the company, the indicia, etc?

The "opening" credits could be a "title sequence," which is something I've only seen a couple times in comics (Hickman's The Red Wing and the Morrison/Quitely New X-Men)

RussellLissau

Occasionally I've seen the credit box on the last page. Indicia, too.

SteveHorton

Lately I've been a fan of the three horizontal panel page 1 followed by the splash + credits on page 2.

NolanTJ

Read the Cardboard Valise by Ben Katchor recently, and he starts the book on the inside cover... also saw a volume of 20th Century Boys where the cover had the first panel front and center.  I think playing with conventions like this are really slick...

AdamGeen

I love this sort of stuff. Change is GOOD! Mix it up. Play with it.

GregCarter

I was intrigued by Terry Moore's new series "Rachel Rising" having the credits in the back of the singles. I like mixing it up.

DwightWilliams

With Local Hero's first issue, we went with "inside front cover". Not sure if we're going to stick with that yet.

JasonAQuest

Humbug.

Don't get me wrong: I respect the creativity that can go into different ways of handling credits: Eisner's "Spirit" drawings, opening sequences in many movies, etc.  But they strike me as creativity spent in service to the mundane... turning lemons into lemonade.  Movies and TV do opening credits to solve the problem that 1) audiences won't sit thru them at the end, but 2) directors, actors, etc. want audiences to see their names anyway.  So we get decompressed establishing shots. production numbers, and/or names flashing on the screen over the acting for the first few minutes.  Most of the time it fights for attention with (or just delays) the story.  But you don't have to do that with comics.  You can put the credits on a non-story page, where readers will see them (unless they really don't care, in which case... they don't care), and the credits don't have to get in the way of the storytelling.

marvinmann

Its like "cute." Its a virtue. Its just rather low on the list of virtues. Still, attractively designed credits can enhance the feeling of a comic or movie, set a tone, just as the cover can. Not all storytelling has to linear.

JustinJordan

I haven't given a lot of though, to be honest. The only time I have thought about it is when I read Joshua Williamson's Xenoholics, which opens on a two page splase by virtue of using the inside front cover. I had never thought of that. Not even a little. It would necessitate moving the credits if/when I use/steal the idea.

The final issue of Luther does have what I refer to in the script as an after the credits sequence, but it's not a reference to this sort of thing, really.

anthonyperuzzo

i tend to forget about credit pages unless the writer has a plan for them. Sometimes I have an idea that really works like this one:



But i can't do the Eisner thing on everything. Most of the time, I feel like the credits and title are a distraction to the page and would rather have something like a title page instead.

BrandonSeifert

Just so we're all on the same page — what I'm suggesting with an "Title Sequence" in a comic is more akin to the following than anything people have talked about so far:

Except that, obviously, that page is an ad for an upcoming comic rather than the comic itself.

So, my suggestion: A series of panels (like this) incorporating the series title and the primary creators, plus some sense of the tone of the series a "recap"/synopsis of the set-up for the series. Similar to the title sequences in a lot of TV shows.

The stuff you've all posted is neat and food for thought, but I don't think any of it so far has been of a piece with what I'm getting at here.

SteveHorton

On a related note, I kind of like the intro sequences that name all the characters and what they do.

BrandonSeifert

Me too, @SteveHorton. Or at least intro sequences that name the characters, and show you what they look like.

Basically, what I'm suggesting is another tool to make an issue of a comic more accessible for a new (or lapsed) reader, using the medium and language of the comic instead instead of a different medium like prose.

GregCarter

I love the movie Apocalypse Now. One of the main reasons I love it, and love to expose people to it without warning, is that it just fucking starts. No credits. It's the perfect opening to the movie, but the credits never come! If I can ever figure out how to start a comic like that, I'll be happy.

I know that's the opposite of what you mean, Brandon, but still... that's my dream.

BrandonSeifert

Yeah, Apocalypse Now is one where the title is never featured in the movie, except as graffiti on a wall seen in a shot.

There again, not what I'm talking about. Maybe I should relax and let this turn into the general discussion of titles and credits in comics it clearly wants to be.

GregCarter

So you mean starting off the comic doing a "Previously on Buffy the Vampire Slayer" and the credits together, but making it the first page of the comic?

For someone like me who only releases a print issue every few months that would be a good idea. On a monthly... might get old unless done very well. Unless you're talking GN, which is where it would make more sense. 

BrandonSeifert

That's actually part of why I'd want to do it on the inside front cover, @GregCarter — so if you're already familiar with the plot/set-up, it's easily skippable.

I think a "title sequence" that's consistent throughout a storyline or a miniseries would work, even if it was in each issue.

"Previously on Buffy the Vampire Slayer" was always kind of annoying, because unless you physically fast-forwarded past it you had to just wait until it was over, whether you needed the information in it or not. In a comic, you can just skim past something like that in a way you can't work something filmed.

ShawnRichison

I like the Supernatural model of "Then..." and "Now..." where "Then..." is a collection of scenes/backstory that relate to the upcoming episode and "Now..." is the beginning of the episode/teaser.  Then they shoot you the Series title card (which is probably only 3 seconds) and the Episode title, over the action, followed by opening credits as the story progresses.  Finally, you have your end credits at the finish of the story over black cards.  I'd love to see/do that in comics. (maybe I'll do something like that with my upcoming story with @DinoCaruso since we only have ten pages...)

GregCarter

@BrandonSeifert The Buffy Season 8 and 9 singles do the "Previously on Buffy" in text on the inside cover with the credits. Easily skippable in a comic, as you say, but there for someone that picks it up in the store and needs it. It's dead boring though, which is such a waste. But the idea is sound.

BrandonSeifert

@GregCarter — "It's dead boring though, which is such a waste." Yeah, that's not good. Also, I've mostly only seen those pages done in prose, and I think it'd work out better to do them comics-style (comics being, you know, comics and not prose, after all).

(I think Incredible Herc or something like that had a comics-style recap page, which I also liked. But that was very much a recap page, rather than a "title credits" kind of thing.)

Owen_Jones

Deadpool or Cable vs Deadpool, I can't remember which, did a funny take in the same way, but also as a recap of the last issue/s rather than opening credits.

Global Frequency had a three panel final page with credits in each of the panels. So as @GregCarter ;mentioned with Apocalypse Now, they just started and you enjoyed the ride enough that you paid attention to the creators names at the end, where as you might blow by them at the beginning. Works to drag you in when many of the comics I'm reading at present seem to go for exposition and slow build.

 I also think one of the early issues of Planetary, the Hong Kong ghost maybe?, did a panel then a gutter with two credits in then a panel etc for the first page. Which I think works well because you aren't interrupting or obscuring the panel, whilst at the same time you have the movie feel of quick cuts interspersed with credits to heighten your attention.      

pjperez

Brandon, I actually totally "get" what you're saying. The "opening credits" roll over your opening panels the same way they do on a TV series' establishing moments, and then all the rest of the credits roll after the end of the issue. It's a neat idea, and I'd be curious to see how it would play out. My only concern is it being one of those tricks of another medium that might not play well in the comic medium.

Now, onto the related credits discussion that doesn't directly address your idea, but does address a lot of what was brought up here: Although I don't agree that it's making lemonade out of lemons, I am one of those people who thinks there's way too much though put into how credits/introductions are displayed these days for ongoing/multi-issue comics. If people were better serial storytellers,* they wouldn't need all of the bells and whistles of "previously on" or to do cutesy character introductions. They'd grab the reader right away with the story, be clever enough to catch them up with any ongoing bits in a non-obtrusive way, and leave 'em with a cliffhanger/reason to come back. The credits would be tertiary to anything else, hell, an afterthought.

That's just my two cents.

*This isn't to say everyone not doing this is a "bad" serial storyteller. Just that they're victim of the "writing-for-trade" zeitgeist, either by editorial mandate or keeping up with the Joneses. Just to clarify, in case anyone thinks I'm slagging an entire industry! One of the kindest compliments I ever got from a reviewer was him noting that one could easily jump into any chapter of the "Omega" serial that ran last year in Omega Comics Presents and easily know what's up.

BrandonSeifert

@pjperez —

"The "opening credits" roll over your opening panels the same way they do on a TV series' establishing moments, and then all the rest of the credits roll after the end of the issue."

No, that's not at all what I'm talking about.

I'm talking about an entirely separate sequence of panels that is not part of the story that serves to

1. Provide the most prominent creator credits, 
2. Provide the title,
3. Provide a sense of the tone/approach of the comic through the panels selected/provide, and
4. Optionally introduce the cast or the series concept.

Since I don't seem to be explaining this in a fashion that everyone is following, here's the Babylon 5 opening title sequence (from all the seasons of the show). The first season credits sequence lays out the premise of the show very bluntly, and then lists the names of the cast. Later seasons vary in the amount of plot information they involve, versus the amount of "tone" they're trying the get across; they also make a bigger effort to introduce the cast/actors.

Another example that's heavy on tone, "visual mission statements" and character introduction but light on plot, is the Firefly title sequence.

What I'm suggesting is doing the same sort of thing, but as a sequence of panels and text rather than as a filmed sequence with music and actors' voices.

I can't give you an example of that in comics — because I've never seen one. I can give you *plenty* of examples of "The "opening credits" roll over your opening panels the same way they do on a TV series' establishing moments, and then all the rest of the credits roll after the end of the issue."

pjperez

Ah. Got it. It was what I was picturing visually, just not the content. Honestly, it just sounds like a more creative, visual and less forced version of what Marvel does with some of its titles. You should just TRY IT, and see how it works.

BrandonSeifert

@pjperez That's the thought!

marvinmann

Of course, after you've rolled the intro, you'll need to cut to a commercial

pjperez

I smell a sponsorship opportunity.

BrandonSeifert

That's an idea — doing comics with ads that are specifically included after "act breaks."

I didn't say it was a *good* idea, of course...

marioboon

I don't see the point of them.

Especially when it's a company policy to have credits on the inside cover and then you somehow do a credits page in the art too.

JasonAQuest

That's an idea — doing comics with ads that are specifically included after "act breaks."

I didn't say it was a *good* idea, of course...

You should have, because it is.